VentureBeat - Latest Comments in Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

coach purses — Mon, 10 May 2010 11:50:10 -0000

Here really interesting! Begain love here

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

James Garvey — Mon, 21 Dec 2009 01:21:37 -0000

I really appreciate your help, it is very useful for me,you will get good grades!
You will be successful.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Inter — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 19:28:27 -0000

I liked the program and the technique very much.

But, I don't understand why they needed $400M to
make a not so complicated program/algorithm.

The fact that it is patented, means that
I can't use this technique in, say,
my e-mails, a Power Point slide or even
a hand written letter?

I don't like, IMHO, their pricing scheme,
based on a subscription.
It is too expensive.

Why can't they just charge for the program
once?

Thanks.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Martin Cohen — Sun, 08 Jul 2007 13:23:16 -0000

Many years ago
(over 30)
I read some books
written in EXACTLY this style
by a couple named Leiber (iirc).
They were on scientific subjects
such as relativity
(special and general).
They were written for
"T.C.Mits"
which stood for
"The Common Man in the Street".

I enjoyed them very much.

So, how can this be patented?

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

ann — Tue, 03 Jul 2007 10:33:05 -0000

re: danielmick 05.14.07 | 1:31 am
Maybe some of us get the point but have used similar techniques along with some not so widely held beliefs. Like tinted saran wrap. It works in some cases quite well. I guess the point is that there are no new, change the world saviors to address every reading problem.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

fjgreer — Sat, 30 Jun 2007 02:59:37 -0000

Huh... am I the only one that found the LiveInk version distracting? It had way too many colors and despite what their claims say, I found the different formatting to detract from the content. All of my reading problems on a computer have been solved by using css that inverts black on white text to white on black. Guess my brain got used to reading computer console output.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

ann chaney — Thu, 28 Jun 2007 12:26:31 -0000

Try stretching

a pink piece of saran wrap

over a round embroidery stretcher

put on top of reading mater

ial.

works for

me.

maybe I'm dyslexic?

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

BrieZchick — Wed, 20 Jun 2007 09:45:07 -0000

At first I though that this was a good idea. Then I read the comments made and thought that they had good points against this "LiveInk" software.

So I then tried to read the paragraph in "LiveInk" versus the original paragraph and found it to be easier for me to read the original paragraph. I liked how the "LiveInk" started, but then it started going all wavy and I didn't like that. I can read poetry just fine... but I prefer to read the original way, however, I would not be opposed to offer "LiveInk" to students if it woudl help them. More research is needed I feel.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Miklos — Sun, 27 May 2007 11:26:23 -0000

I am not convinced that testing this kind of layout with adults who have been trained since childhood to read text in blocks is indicative of its potential (or lack thereof). Ideally, it would be better, I think, to compare the reading performance (speed, understanding, recall) of adults taught, as children, to read one or the other form of text.

There are also other ways (than reformatting) to add syntactic and semantic reading clues to online text: the Trésor de la langue française (a dictionary) allows one to highlight selected parts of the text (definition, citations...) with colors which the reader can choose (see example at the bottom of http://mmdl.free.fr/blog-m/....

One should also keep in mind that different readers need/make use of different kinds of clues (and Live Ink seems to be geared to high school children who may have less reading skills that literate adults, for whom such clues might actually hamper and slow down the reading performance).

Lastly, the kind of clues may depend on the nature of the text - I wonder how their software would reformat already formatted poems - from Haikus to Ogden Nash's.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Live Ink Research Team — Mon, 21 May 2007 00:13:35 -0000

Regarding the comment by Free Innovator, above: "Oops. My work is undone by reformatting that destroyed the indentations. Oh, well."

The "undoing" of Free Innovator's manual attempts to construct a Live Ink cascade in this VentureBeat comment area illustrates that the underlying technology required, not only to generate, through syntactic algorithms, but also to assure consistent display of the multi-dimensional sentences, is presently not supported by conventional text reflow protocols. In other words, the prior art "teaches away" from the representation of sentences as multidimensional spatial structures, and instead treats the formatting of sentences as mere linear structures.
To see how our technology makes it possible to dynamically alternate between block and Live Ink format, see our FAQ page at: http://www.liveink.com/FAQ.php

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

SPiCOLi — Sun, 20 May 2007 04:51:47 -0000

It makes sense. My eye were drawn to the left-side
example at first, so I read it first, and it was much easier to read.

This isn't a huge breakthrough, but it does make understanding the content of a paragraph easier, the first time which I like...

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Kate — Thu, 17 May 2007 14:43:09 -0000

Okay, so did you notice that the width of the columns of chunked text are very similar to the width of a column in a newspaper. We've known for a long time that that width is easier for people to read quickly. I'd be interested in a test that compared the chunk text to the same text in a newspaper column with the exact same font and leading.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

smb12321 — Tue, 15 May 2007 03:04:56 -0000

Enough with the PC crap. The guy is not insulting anyone but trying to improve reading skills through scientific methods and I give him kudos. The problem is real world (compactness) vs this world (ultra spaced out). What does this do to literary structure - paragraph, sections, chapters, etc? Does it lead to better reading in the "real world"?

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

SW — Mon, 14 May 2007 20:20:36 -0000

The idea is really interesting and primitive to me. However, I find myself becoming disoriented and dyslexic after many attempts of reading broken sentences. This may only work for some struggling readers who exceptionally need such accommodations.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Brad — Mon, 14 May 2007 18:59:14 -0000

I just installed the ClipRead client. I sure wish the legal agreement and large readme text during the install phase were written in live ink! That is the kind of text that would really benefit. I guess the lawyers nixed that idea...

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Free innovator — Mon, 14 May 2007 14:49:49 -0000

Oops. My work is undone by reformatting that destroyed the indentations. Oh, well.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Free innovator — Mon, 14 May 2007 14:48:02 -0000

John,
if you can document
your prior art
could you post this fact
in a few visible places
using good searchable phrases?
I hope that Walker Reading Technologies
succeeds and prospers
with their Live Ink product,
but based on their head start
in a sophisticated technology,
not based on their exclusion
of competitors.
If you do this,
it would serve a good cause,
and you'd likely be paid someday
to do the work
of assembling the evidence
by a legal team
challenging the patent.
BTW, a recent Supreme Court ruling
should make it much easier
to challenge patents
based on prior art.

In writing the above text
I found that
one complexly structured sentence
seemed almost necessary
and yet made me uncomfortable
regarding its readability.
That's what prompted me
to try this formatting.
And this is a reason to expect
that the spread
of this technology
could improve the quality
of discourse
by facilitating the expression
of more complex thoughts.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

sunni — Mon, 14 May 2007 12:59:31 -0000

I find the broken sentences more difficult to read because the rhythm is uncomfortable, and the line break put emphases where they may or may not be appropriate. It makes me go back and re-read to see which emphasis I should coose, instead of allowing me to interpret as I read. I believe many English speakers gravitate to iambic pentameter...try that instead of short phrases or clauses...

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Chuck — Mon, 14 May 2007 10:34:29 -0000

I agree with Daniel. While the formatting of the text appears to a layman to go against standard text approaches, the research is built on sound previous research.

Many of the comments above seem to be rooted in centuries old methods of presenting information in text form. Even speed reading methodology is based in extracting phrases out of the block of text.

As an educator, I see the current generation of readers totally focused on electronic reading using online media sources like Facebook, IM, Drudge Report and MyWay.com, for example.

To be honest, I'm excited to see how what innovations will be a result of their addition to the body of knowledge regarding human cognitive behavior.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

danielmick — Mon, 14 May 2007 04:46:20 -0000

I forgot to add:

I also reformatted the plain text with improvement variables (larger font, wider kerning, line space, etc), and while it improved speed over the original text, LiveInk was still easier and quicker to read.

I have a degree in Digital Media Arts with a Graphic Design minor. LiveInk has incorporated these principles along with their sentence diagramming to make what I imagine to be the easiest and quickest text to read.

(Btw, there is still significant debate about whether serif or sans-serif fonts lend themselves better to easier/quicker reading. Don't claim authoritatively that one is better than the other).

Finally, I don't think LiveInk is advocating their product for any hardcopy text. That would be ridiculous; don't get hussied up about having to rebuild libraries. And as for online article length, finger scroll buttons were invented for just such ease of use.

Daniel Mick

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

danielmick — Mon, 14 May 2007 04:31:34 -0000

1. Yes, it LOOKS like haiku. No, it is not. It is obvious from even a glance at their examples that the sentences are broken down and situated according to component and literary purpose.

All of
you
trying to be
clever simply by chopping
up sentences have
completely
missed the
point.

2. Most of the dismissive comments seem to be from snobbish "power readers." While I've never been clocked, I read voraciously. I'm accustomed and trained to read text in blocks, but I'm intrigued by ways to possibly read faster, and gladly entertain the educational gains it may provide for students. (Off the top of my head, a similar example might be the backlash to independent-handed ergonomically designed keyboards from 'traditional typists.' Yet those typists rave about the improvements the keyboards have made in their typing speed and ease).

3. To many above: how is any of this "dumbing down" reading, or "lazy" education? As several other commenters noted, they've similar approaches have been used for years for notetaking, coding, legal documentation, etc. How does this method (which relies heavily on principles of sentence diagramming) make reading lazy or dumb?!

4. Directly related, while they are a for profit company, they are pushing their product on what appears to be quite solid research. Don’t dismiss extensive research with flippant claims of your own: “It sure looks dumb! So I dun think it makes kids more dumber.”

5. Yes, the formatting is different, and shame on LiveInk for allowing themselves to be criticized so easily by submitting that as their example. But shame on you commenters for immediate dismissal without more investigation because of those simple facts. I quickly retyped their example keeping all variables the same (font size, white space, color, etc). And the LiveInk IS easier to read.

As a language educator and enthusiastic online reader myself (I spend at least 3-4 hours reading material online every day), I think LiveInk is a very exciting development. I can't wait to see what comes of it both for education purposes, and for online reading and comprehension. I imagine that LiveInk, or similar methods, will quickly become the de facto standard for bloggers and others who spend most of their time reading online (like me) to quickly parse information. And maybe it’ll progress to be an online reading standard in the near future.

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Barry — Sun, 13 May 2007 21:05:07 -0000

Is it just me or does this reprocessed text look like haiku?

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Live Ink Research Team — Sun, 13 May 2007 16:20:31 -0000

Our company is grateful for the many, varied, and candid comments that VentureBeat and SlashDot readers have posted on this article.

LIVE INK -- AN OPTIONAL TOOL FOR READING ONLINE TEXT. We have developed this technology as a tool, to assist readers of online text -- only if and when they feel they need it. We believe the online medium that is used for text distribution and display can be optimized for the human perception and comprehension of the subject matter represented by the text. Our technology exploits two main attributes of digital text: (i) machine-readability (which allows computer algorithms to analyze the text); (ii) the ability to use more space (and colors) at a relatively low additional cost (compared to paper).

VISUAL-SYNTACTIC FORMATTING. The process, and the cognitive science basis, is as much syntactic as it is visual. Mere typographical adjustments do not extract or display syntactic attributes; indeed, the fact that text is linguistically "inert" is exploited by all typographical conventions and software, which all use mechanical/geometric word-wrap processes to "pour" text into available space as if it were liquid. For our processes, the segmentation and indentation information is driven primarily by syntactic (i.e., grammatical) information extracted from the text itself. However, the ultimate positions of words, phrases and clauses, relative to one another, in the Live Ink format, also involve special computer-generated calculations that aim to construct -- within the small "circle" of visual perception that occurs at each fixation -- spatial cues conveying these syntactic relationships. The text is not otherwise edited and none of the words in the text are removed or changed.

This is a software-based tool, and the free trial software is being made available to show that computer-based syntactic algorithms, which are fairly complex, are performing several million computations to analyze and reformat each sentence in real-time. As a tool, it is meant to assist readers if and when they need it: dyslexics might use it for basic information, highly-proficient attorneys might use it only for reading the Federal Register.

ABOUT THE US DEPT OF EDUCATION-FUNDED RESEARCH. The US Department of Education research we conducted involved yearlong, classroom-based, randomized controlled trials, and spanned grades 6-11. Students read e-textbooks that were either in block text or visual-syntactic format (VSF). The passages read were the assigned readings for students' Social Sciences classes. Reading sessions lasted for 25 minutes each, every other school day, and were followed by a short quiz. Testing included nationally standardized reading proficiency tests (in block format) at both the beginning and at the end of the year. During the year, in addition to quizzes, we analyzed students' scores on unit exams (given every 3 weeks) and semester final exams.

STRENGHTHENING STUDENTS' READING POWER, EVEN WHEN GOING BACK TO BLOCK TEXT. The VSF groups not only had better academic scores (reflecting better understanding and retention of the course material), but they also scored better on block-formatted reading proficiency tests: they had become stronger (not weaker) readers across all types of formatting. The size of these gains was equivalent to having 2 to 3 years' worth of growth in reading proficiency in the span of just one academic year. For example, 7th graders in the VSF group had their reading proficiency, on average, rise to the level of 10th graders, (by national averages), whereas the 7th graders in the control group only made its expected one-year's worth of reading growth.

These gains are also quantifiable as adding 10 to 15 national percentile ranking points to the test, or more than a full-standard deviation. Interestingly, high-school juniors who were mainstream (and were not taking AP courses, such as the college bound students who were studied separately) added, on average, over 10 percentile points to their college admissions ACT tests, compared to control groups. ESOL students also showed very strong gains, but the impact was not confined to these groups. AP students also had increased scores (when tested for comprehension of the college textbooks they were using in their high school's AP History classes).

To use the words of one of the SlashDot commenters, we really did "reformat the brain" not just the type-setting; the method, for these students, strengthened their capacity to recognize phrase and clause structures, and to appreciate the hierarchical nature of sentence grammar.

MORE DATA AVAILABLE ON REQUEST. The Reading Online article (link at our website) summarized data from college and 9th grade students. We also presented the data for the other grades (which were similar to the 9th grade results) to the National Educational Computing Conference at Philadelphia in 2005. We can email a copy of this report to anyone who asks for it at: info@liveink.com.

One commenter felt that our sample sentence in the Reading Online article was a "badly written, run-on sentence" -- it is the first sentence of the Declaration of Independence, written by Thomas Jefferson. There have been many informative and considerate comments. We welcome this exposure and feedback.

THANK YOU AGAIN,
The Reading Research Team at Live Ink
www.liveink.com
info@liveink.com

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Legumes — Sun, 13 May 2007 06:03:13 -0000

This is a great idea, but how will it be applied to the myriad of already existing text on the web? (in terms of licensing fees?)
The fact that poets have used it as an effect for quite a long time is a bit ironic too ;)

Re: Live Ink offers better way to read text online

Kathryn Giesbrecht — Sun, 13 May 2007 05:28:02 -0000

I did this ten years ago with all of my notes. I should have patented it then. But it is nice to see experts now agree with me.